Film Theory: Ant Man’s GIANT Problem (Marvel’s Ant-Man)

Film Theory: Ant Man’s GIANT Problem (Marvel’s Ant-Man)


Big ego, I’ll show you a big ego. I kind of walked right into that one didn’t I? And a taco truck. Damn. What a waste of tacos. [Deadpool: Hey! That’s my line!] [Intro Song] Hello Internet, welcome to Film Theory the show that puts out new episodes only slightly more often than Marvel puts out new superhero movies. I mean, seriously, it feels like Infinity War just happened [ikr?] but it’s already time to put that one behind us to focus on a story with some smaller stakes. You might have noticed that Scott Lang aka the Ant-Man was absent from the latest Avengers movie. [Really? I didn’t realize] And that’s not a case of him being tucked away in some microscopic hiding place. Believe me, I checked. Every promotional poster out there. [Along with emptying every can of Diet Coke in the house] And I found some weird things by doing that too. Like this. And this. Ooh, there’s a hidden Mickey, that Illuminati symbol wasn’t all that surprising, considering it’s Disney But yeah, no Ant-Man as far as the eye could see. All we hear in the movie is that he and Hawkeye, quote “took a deal” since being a hero was too hard on their families. Aww, being a superhero is hard, is it? Boohoo. Now half the universe is dead. [SPOILER ALERT] Not like that’s gonna be a lot easier on the fam. Anyways, in case you’ve forgotten, Ant-Man has the ability to shrink down to ant size using what’s known as Pym Particles the marvelous marvel-ous Get it? [Yes, we get it] Miracle matter that can mess with the size, mass, and density of any substance. We most often see him using the power of the Pym Particle to shrink himself down to the size of an ant. [Hence the name: Ant-Man] However, one of the most most memorable Ant-Man scenes from the MCU has to be him doing the reverse. In Captain American, Captain American – the Korean ripoff version of Captain America. In Captain America Civil War, he blows himself up to massive size becoming the most powerful hero on the battlefield [So I guess Vision doesn’t exist] Throwing trucks around, taking missiles to the chest – basically turning unstoppable until Spider-Man decides to take a page from Luke Skywalker’s playbook and ties up his legs to trip him like an AT-AT that forgot how to walk. [Spider-Man:] You know that part on that snow planet, with the walking thingies. [Mat-Pat:] I’m calling BS here, by the way. It is the most unbelievable part of the movie Perhaps the most unbelievable part of the MCU. Peter Parker clearly would know what all of those things are named. #NotMyNerd Anyway, it makes you wonder why doesn’t Ant-Man use this power more often. [Ant-Man:] I do it all the time. [Mat-Pat:] Really? Because this is the first time we’ve ever seen you do it in the movie. [Ant-Man:] Once. In a lab. [Mat-Pat:] All right. So at first this might seem like a lazy cop-out by the writers, [Ya think?] But when you look at the real-life science It actually makes sense. Being big doesn’t just take a fictional subatomic Pym Particle – a power like this is gonna have some weird side effects to Scott’s body. As it turns out that there’s an extreme cost for being big – and that’s the lesson for today. How being bigger isn’t always being better and considering it’s a power he’s gonna be using again in a second movie, “Ant-Man and the Wasp” Learning the oddities that come with being big is gonna be essential so that he doesn’t end every fight, hangry. [Ant-Man:] Does anyone have any orange slices? [Mat-Pat]: Have you ever stopped to wonder why an elephant is less agile than a mouse? [No Mat, I can’t say I have] I mean sure we all intuitively know that big things tend to move slower But why? You might say that it’s because they weigh more and yeah, that’s certainly true But consider this: if you took a mouse and blew it up wouldn’t it retain the same abilities that allow it to scamper around? Or by the same token if you take Scott Lang, an athletic superhero and do the equivalent of dropping him into Photoshop to stretch the corner of his transform box wouldn’t he just have the same abilities but bigger and stronger than before? He’s still the same proportions after all. I mean sure he may be gaining more mass But at the same time, his muscles are also growing and gaining strength including all of those fast twitch muscle fibers that humans use when they sprint. So why is it so much harder for mega Scott to perform basic actions when he’s big in these fight scenes well, believe it or not But the answer is actually a universal law of mathematics [Shock] that applies to all matter in the universe Man between this and the last ant-man theory about how he would be able to create black holes Ant-man seems to be the key to unlocking the secrets of existence. Maybe that’s why he’s not in infinity war He’s too op. This secret universal law is known as the square-cube law all the way back to Galileo [No no no no no no no] in 1638 yeah The same Galileo who discovered Saturn’s rings the moons of Jupiter and taught the world that planets orbit around the Sun Meanwhile Here I am rewatching civil wars Airport scene covered in cheeto dust Galileo: making the rest of the world feel like a slacker since 1640 anyway teaching people that they weren’t the center of the universe didn’t make him very popular with the Roman Inquisition Or Twitter quite frankly resulting in him getting put under house arrest And since he didn’t have access to candy crush or cutthroat kitchen [Or Full House] reruns it gave him a whole lot of time to do math Math that led to yet another discovery that makes us all feel like underachievers the square-cube law aka Exactly what we need to analyze Ant -Man [Big surprise] the easiest way to explain the law is this imagine a tesseract that’s one inch by one inch by one inch it has a surface area of six square inches because each face has an area of One square inch and there are six phases the volume is 1 times 1 times 1 or 1 cubic inch great If only AP calc exams were this easy [Tell me about it] now suppose that we double each dimension of the tesseract making it 2 by 2 by 2 Surface areas now 24 square inches and volume is now 8 cubic inches our surface area increased by a factor of 4 But the volume increased by a factor of 8 now look at this We doubled the size of the tesseract right meaning that we multiplied everything by 2 But the surface area increased by 2 squared or 4 and the volume increased by 2 Cubed or 8 if we had tripled the size of everything from our 1 by 1 by 1 Tesseract surface area would now be 54 and volume 27 surface area would have increased by a factor of 9 or 3 squared and volume by a factor of 27 or 3 cubed in other words by increasing the dimension by a given factor the surface area will increase by the square of that factor and the volume will increase by the Cube of that factor. That is the square cube law in a nutshell [I think I got it, but just in case.. Tell me the whole thing again I wasn’t listening] Congratulations, you made it through all the math for today’s episode Here’s a chocolate [After the Willy Wonka episode, I ain’t touching that] and an achievement and a thousand points added to your theorists score Make sure you keep that one in a safe place now, then what’s the significance of all those? darn Tesseracts to Ant Man and his gigantism well,
as Ant-Man grows other properties are gonna change as well specifically his mass is gonna increase in the same way that his volume does It’ll be the cube of whatever factor he increases by so if he scales up by five his mass is multiplied by five cubed or a hundred and twenty five times and that’s cool and all but there’s a big Problem here strength only scales with area when you want to figure out how strong a bone is You don’t look at how long it is or how much volume it has you only care about how thick it is You care about its cross-sectional area the same applies to muscle strength So at five times the size and a hundred and twenty five times the weight ant-man strength is only gonna multiply by 25 The TL;DR of all this when you make something bigger You’re not actually making it stronger by the same amount the more you scale something up It becomes relatively less and less strong for an example of this in nature Just look at deer white-tailed deer are a hundred and fifty pounds while elk are six Hundred pounds just by looking at them. You can tell that the Elks legs are much thicker than the lighter white-tailed deer legs This is because an Elks bones and muscles need to be much thicker to support the extra weight But even in spite of all that extra girth elk are still more likely to break their bones. The long story short here is Supporting additional mass is hard it is biologically very Difficult, it requires a lot of extra internal infrastructure in your body Infrastructure that humans and Ant-Man specifically just aren’t built for [Aww] so let’s take one more Look at ant-man if we figure out the factor of increased for Ant-Man size We can quickly assess how that would affect his mass and strength now in the trailers for the new movie We hear him bragging about how big he’s able to get. “How big did you get?” “Twenty-one feet, you?” “65 feet” “Sixty-five?” the actor who plays ant-man Paul Rudd is reportedly 5 foot 10 inches Meeting that Ant-Man has to be able to scale up to a maximum of 11 times his normal body size Now remember the square-cube law his mass and volume will increase by a cube of that factor of increase so his resulting mass is going to increase by a factor of 11 times 11 times 11, or 1331. Websites say that Rudd weighs in at about 171 pounds or 78 kilos So in giant form, he’s actually gonna be weighing in at a “modest” 220 7601 pounds or 100 3800 18 kilograms. That’s the same as 15 elephants or about one space shuttle however, the cross sectional area of his muscles and bones will only increase by the square of 11 [So.. square shaped Eggos?] or 121 getting over a hundred times stronger might seem like a lot but it means almost nothing when you consider that he’s over a Thousand times heavier than he was which explains why Ant Man who’s normally an agile Superhero capable of all kinds of acrobatic feats is reduced to a slow-moving behemoth in civil war Honestly considering how much additional weight his legs are carrying It’s a wonder that he’s even able to be standing at all which begs the question or for all of you on reddit Who are bothered by that idiomatic usage of the phrase raises the question, could he actually stand? Well, it took a bit of digging but I found out bones are much better at handling compressive forces than shear forces This is because bones are made up of columns of collagen and calcium phosphate [Wut?] like bundles of twigs and because they run vertically through the bone they give the bone strength through its leg to show you just how big of a difference all this makes it takes about 4,000 Newton’s of force to fracture your femur when you hit it this way a shear direction, but 50,000 Newton’s of force when you apply the force this way a Compressive force over ten times more force required that’s according to the e study guide for physics, by the way It was a hard number to find anyway at normal human size. It would mean that Scott Lang would need to weigh over 11,000 240 pounds to break his legs. No big worries there or for the rest of humanity no matter how many cheeseburgers we eat [Oh, how I hate America] But then like Mario jump man on his shrooms We Gigantify it his leg strength scales by 121 meaning that he can now support around 1 million 360 thousand forty pounds on his legs and considering he weighs in at just under 230 pounds when he’s in large scale He is well in the clear someone get that man an orange slice. He deserves it But what’s coolest about all of this, is that well, yes It explains why he has to be slow in careful in his mega form it also explains how he’s so incredibly powerful in his micro form because you see all of this also works in Reverse if increasing your size Increases the ratio of mass to strength then Decreasing your muscle mass should have the opposite effect more strength relative to your size According to the Marvel website ant-man can shrink himself down to half an inch That’s him scaling himself down a hundred and forty two times Which means that his bone and muscle cross section will be shrunk down by a hundred and forty two Squared but his volume and mass will be shrunk down by a hundred and forty two cubed That means that when ant-man is half an inch tall his strength ratio increases by a factor of a hundred and forty two That’s the equivalent of a six-foot man feeling like they only weigh 1.4 pounds Imagine what kind of athletic feats your body would be capable of if you gained that factor of strength You could lift things that were way bigger than you [And not as lame as a fridge] in fact That’s exactly what we observe in the animal kingdom [In Disney World?] Ants are capable of lifting objects that are hundreds of times their own weight while elephants are only capable of lifting Objects that are around one tenth of their weight true in absolute terms. The elephant might be capable of lifting bigger objects, but Proportionally the ant seems so much stronger and that’s a big part of where Ant-Man’s powers come from for example He has the ability to change size at will while maintaining his momentum meaning He starts an incredible sprint while small and blows himself up to deliver a devastating punch. I always hear the phrase That bigger is better [I mean, it was in HSM 3] but as we saw in civil war being big has its costs while ant man’s Gigantic form might be one of the most visually impressive things we see him do in the movies his real strength lies Not in his ability to grow but his ability to shrink Scott Lang proves that it’s not the size of your superhero But rather the size of their power ratio “If you two are finished comparing sizes” “65” well, the science proves it at least Scott still seems really proud of that 65 footer But hey, that’s just a theory a film Theory and if you missed my last Ant-Man theory on why is technically the most devastating character in the Marvel MCU [The Marvel Marvel Cinematic Unerverse? God, it’s Detective Comics Comics all over again] It’s right here click the button tear left Or Make sure you give that subscribe button a big old smack so you can be updated about what crazy theories we have coming up next Like have you ever wondered what the optimum strategy is for winning the purge? [Hide undergroud?] Oh, yeah There’s a right answer for solving the purge one that you’re gonna find out next week But only if you hit the subscribe button hurry, you only have 5 seconds left in this video to do it 5 4 3 Don’t get left in the purge Captions and [cfdstr]s by Epic Remarc

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  1. In micro form, he would die of freezing because humans aren’t built to have that relationship of surface area and mass. Humans produce enough energy for our size, but rats need a lot more energy because their mass is small compared to surface area. If he went big, he would be an explosion of blood.

  2. so in the first ant man theory he said his mass wouldn't change due to the pym particles only reducing the space between atoms and now it does change his mass? XD

  3. In the movie he said the mass does not change when he shrinks. The length between his atoms gets smaller.

  4. You're also forgetting that Scott's metabolism extra mass wouldn't be able to handle the proportioned metabolism, so his blood would boil until he eventually explodes

  5. I wonder why antmans punch affects the whole body or face of the victim, wouldn't it just puncture or penetrate the skin like a needle

  6. 11:39
    This section kinda explains why he wasn’t super heavy and was able to walk in top of the guys gun
    I read in a comment once about, how the person thought he got smaller while still having the same strength and wait
    But now I get it

    U have a perfectly normal ego

  7. The reason spider man acted like he did not know what both, t-47 speeders, and atats where was so he iron man and war machine would know. It needed to be dumbed down for them.

  8. He wouldn’t be gaining mass because he stays the same weight and when he shrinks the molecules would shrink the mass would stay the same so Spider-Man should not have been able to swing around him

  9. TBH MatPat teaches me more about this kind of stuff than both my Math teacher and Science teacher. THATS SAYING SOMETHING!!!

  10. Just re watching this theory for the third time and i realized that in his last theory he said the Pym particles only increased or decreased the space between atoms and not the number of atoms therefore not changing the mass of an object or the weight but only changing the density meaning that when he becomes really big he wouldn't get really slow and would still be able to move at the same speed but he would just be able to jump higher due to his different density size ratio. Also mat pat i love your channel and i just want to help!

  11. Hi matpat I was watching a movie of Scooby-Doo and please don't make fun of me for watching it but I saw this part and Scooby-Doo movie of camp Scare and I saw a part in the movie where the Mystery Machine is on a rowboat and it's holding it up can really hold up a van or car with a lot of people in it including a dog.

    And please don't make fun of me I am special needs and autistic and people think that special needs in autistic people are really dumb and stupid I really hope that you will take on my theory and maybe take on the other Scooby Doo movies I'm sorry if it really sounds stupid thank you🐲🐉🌀

  12. Strength is the sum all forces applied by all muscle cells, which is proportional to number of cells which proportional to volume.
    Not area.

  13. But like… he’s not gonna gain any weight though… In the first ant man movie they explained that they’re not actually making Scott smaller they’re just taking away the space between the atoms, electrons neutrons and protons. And then when he goes back to his normal size he’s just regaining that empty space. So when he goes big he’s just gonna keep adding empty space in between the atoms of his body meaning he won’t gain any weight at all all he’ll just be way less dense. He shouldn’t have a harder time standing up he should basically just be floating around like a balloon or at least feel lighter and all that. His movements would probably be slower than normal because less dense objects don’t cut through air as fast and easy. But he wouldn’t be unable to stand because his bones and muscles would break, it would be the opposite.

  14. Antman's Mass would not increase , the only thing that's increasing here is the distance between his atoms, he's not getting extra atoms from somewhere just like the same way when he becomes small size is atons aren't going anywhere they're just compressing together , so if Scott Lang increased this size by 60 feet his mass and weight would still be the size of adult male anywhere from 190 to 215 lb , so you would have a 60 foot tall Scott Lang that weighs around 215 lds anybody could knock him over he would be like a huge walking block of Styrofoam

  15. Hey Game Theory I love your guy's show. It makes me feel like I learn something and you use games and movies or films to bring up science and even math. But Looking at this started to get me thinking. One thing I don't understand for the Giant ratio is how would this affect how much force is put into a kick or a punch?

    I am not good with thinking too much science, but movies like Pacific Rim and obviously Ant-man's growth in Civil War/Ant-man and the Wasp got me thinking if the small punch is much more dangerous than a giant punch.

    Loves from TotemPoleJoe. 🙂

  16. Mat-Pat:Can explain the laws of Newton and Galileo is 14 mins and more enjoyable than a professionally trained teacher with years of experience…
    Also Mat-Pat:….is on youtube

  17. 3:36 that's not a mouse thats a gerbil. MATPAT DIDN'T DO HIS RESEARCH!!! TAR AND FEATHER HIM!!!! RUN HIM OUT OF YOUTUBE!!!!!!

  18. but ant man dosent get heavier in the movie it says that he dose not gain mass just that the space between the particles in creases this is the marvel universes way of getting around the conservaition of matter

  19. But didn’t we already establish that his mass stays the same regardless of his size? Like how when he’s shrunken down and punches a dude it’s like a 160lb punch with the fist scaled down to the surface area of a bullet?
    So when he scales upwards his mass should still stay the same as well. I believe you said that the number of atoms in his body doesn’t change. But the space between his atoms does. So.. what’s going on here?

  20. Wouldn't he die from heart problems? I believe i saw somewhere that as the body gets bigger on a linear scale the heart has to work harder on an exponential scale, for ant man to suddenly grow from 5ft. 10in. to lets say 50 ft. the heart would be placed under an exponentially increased amount of stress and (even with scaled up values) wouldn't be able to cope with the immense volume and weight of his blood and the distance said blood needs to travel, the blood would likely begin to pool in the lower veins, arteries, etc. He'd have a straight up heart attack and rapidly lose consciousness due to the brain being starved of blood.

    I believe somewhere in this video will better explain what i'm saying: https://youtu.be/dbOSHoa7h3E

  21. In the last Ant-Man Theory you specifically said that "pym-particles don't change the mass of an object, just the distance between all the particles within that object." Just wanted to say because it would seem that his volume would increase and therefore would would not cause him to overheat, but freeze to death after a while, unless some weird Super Hero Metabolism saves him. And at the same time, going small would cause him to overheat instead of causing him to freeze to death. After all, every living thing has heat to generate and release. How he could stand, because Density happens to be a factor of Gravitational force, weight, it would mean that being big would cause him to be lighter and being smaller would cause him to be heavier. With those types of scales, 121;142, they will be gigantic factors, unless Density is not a factor… Then my Physics Teacher in 8th Grade has lied to me. I am a Senior in Highschool btw. Just some thoughts here if what you said in the previous theory was true and it only affects the size and density.

  22. i’ve been falling asleep while watching these videos for the past two months, and now i can’t sleep without them💀😂😂😂

  23. Sorry to dig up comments on an old video. But, there largest and most glaring problem here isn't the square cube law, especially since it doesn't apply to Ant-Man. It is explained, repeatedly, in the comic books and the movies that Ant Man shrinks by reducing the empty space between his atoms and sub atomic particles. For this reason, he maintains his mass when he shrinks. His density is what changes. He's 1/2" tall but still weighs the same. It's pretty much the cornerstone of his power in the comics.

    This concept is completely and utterly dismissed when his goes giant. Because, logically, if he's spreading his atoms apart to becomes larger (note the, "without tearing myself apart," reference he makes) he's decreasing his density. Even though he's 63 ft tall he still weighs exactly the same. He should still have been as fast as he was before, but a gentle breeze would have knocked him on his ass. Not to mention break his hand like paper mache when he swiped at the truck.

    There are other problems when he shrinks down to the quantum realm. The first obstacle is he could only shrink down so far before collapsing into a quantum singularity, which, I think was mentioned in passing in the video. The second being that you can only reduce the space between particles so far before you run out of space and then you've got a massive cluster of atoms mashed together. And, I can't even begin to imagine the math for that. So, for me, going giant is still the most irritating thing because it's based on the inverse of the shrinking which they explained in detail with the strict rule that no mass is being created or destroyed.

  24. Dude you're missing something.
    When ant-man turns big or small his mass won't change.(you know, the fact that only atoms in his body come close together or the reverse)

  25. MatPat….

    THE ATOMS DONT GROW THEY SPACE THEMSELFS APART HE WOULDNT GET HEAVIER OR USE THE CUBE WHATEVER THINGY EFFECT BRUH EVEN U SAID THEY WOULDNT

  26. Wait didn’t you say pym-particals don’t change the mass only the volume

    So why is he so heavy you said that the Thomas and ant would float away because they stretch out the atoms

  27. According to Pym particles, Ant-Man would still be just as strong as he was at normal size. So, He would still have increased speed, but not gain strength by growing larger.

  28. You know sometimes being too smart is harmful.
    Few simple things
    You told yourself the mass stays the same. Which means he should float into the space.
    Or there is something that MCU has not explained which helps to proportion the weight and strength
    Like how he gets tiny with so little mass but has the huge amount of strength. So.

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