How Are Custom Aero Bars Made? | GCN Tech Show Ep.111


(metal grinding) – Welcome to the GCN Tech show. This week I’m flying solo, but fear not, it’s going to be a good one. I mean in addition to
hot new Shimano pedals, aero mudguards, new bikes, your upgrades and the Bike Vault, we’ve
also got a special guest. I’m going to be joined
by Edwin from Speedbar, the man behind the custom cockpits used by the world’s fastest riders. (metal grinding) This week on the GCN Tech show, we’ve got a special guest. We’re joined by Edwin Van Vugt. I got that, I got it right? – Yeah, perfect, yeah. – Brilliant. Edwin is the creator of Speedbar, which if you’re unfamiliar are custom aero extension try bars and base bars that are used by the world’s best cyclist, time trialists and also
triathletes as well. Some notable examples would be Victor Campenaerts’ bike
for his hour record. He used Speedbar. And Rohan Dennis in
his world championships ride in Yorkshire, also used Speedbar. So thanks for coming down. – Thanks for having me. – Good to see you. So I’ve asked the audience a load of questions for you,
because there’s a lot of interest in these kind of products. But the first thing I think we need to find out is what is the
aero advantage of the Speedbar? So we’ve got actually a
question from OGG1341, who says “What kind of gains do you get “at 45 kilometers an hour?” – Well it’s hard to really put a number on the gains that the
Speedbar will give you. We can measure a lot of gains, so we can see there is
an aerodynamic gain. We’ve seen a four watt gain, we’ve also seen a 14 watt gain. It really depends on the person who’s using it, the
deep, where it’s tested, how it’s tested. But except from the gains
that we can measure, I guess, and what I’ve
heard for the customers who are using it, the biggest gain actually is the comfort that
the Speedbar will give you. – It is crazy how they do just fit in compared to a round bar. But you say, you know, four to 14 watts– – That’s a lot.
– That’s a significant aero improvement, I mean
that’s the difference between winning or losing
the world’s time trial. – [Edwin] Could be, yeah. – How did you get into this? How did this come about, you
know making these things? How did you get into it? And what was the inspiration for doing it? – Well we were into carbon fiber, we were into it now for 10 years. We started out with a
carbon fiber repair company, which also gave us some
work from pro-tour teams. And actually the idea for the Speedbar came almost four years ago,
during the Rio Olympics. Think everybody can remember Rohan Dennis, during his time trial race, he broke his extension, the extension of his bike, which threw him out of the competition. At that point, I had some good contacts with the team, and I actually send them just a WhatsApp message,
“Hey, maybe it’s a good idea “that I will make a handlebar for them”, and that’s actually how it
all started out. (laughing) So the handlebar that we would like to make for Rohan, the plan actually was to get rid of all the
connections, you know? When you want to get
to the perfect position on your time trial bike,
there’s a lot of spacers involved which are
connected to the base bar, then you have a clamp where your extension is connected in, which is clamped down, and on top of that your arm
pads are connected again. So what we want to create was actually a handlebar with less connections, so like a one piece handlebar. – How many pros are you
making them for now then? People are also asking,
is it just for pros? I’ve got a question from
Meg Dickerson who says, “Can you make me some?” – Yeah, I can. One of the rules that UCI, every product on the bikes that are used during races have to be commercially available. – Well familiar with that rule on the GCN Tech Show. (laughing) – [Edwin] So yeah, of course you can buy a handlebar, everybody can. – Pete Uptigrove asks “What
does a pair of them cost? “And how many can you make?” – They’re not cheap. For starters, it takes me 30 hours of manual labor to
create one of those bars. – And it’s just you making them? – It’s a one man show. If you email us, then
I will email you back. If you come to us for the mold, I will take the mold. I will produce the handlebar, and I will put a stamp on
the box with your handlebar. So it’s only a one man show. We would like to keep it like that, because when you’re in the business of making something
actually very personal, I guess it’s also very important to have contact with only one person. So there’s a lot of hours involved. So the price for the
handlebar starts at €3600, which can vary by if you want to have a computer mount integrated, or in the triathlon world, some people would like to have bottle
cage mounting plate in there. So they’re quite expensive, but yeah, if you see the numbers of hours that we put into one set of handlebar, I think it’s a very honest price. – Yeah, two pairs a week,
maximum working flat out. – [Edwin] Well yeah, it’s
30 hours per handlebar, so two per week, it’s like a 60 hour working week for me. Yeah, I’m sorry– – That’s pretty cool.
– That’s really the maximum I will do. – Well Rohan Dennis has
actually asked a question, saying “Why the beard?” – Well Rohan Dennis. (both laughing) For starters, because you can’t, I guess. (both laughing) No, why the beard? Yeah, why not? – Well, that’s it, Rohan’s been told. Chris Pilling has got a question saying “Is there a fastest arm position? “Is there a best angle for bars, “or the distance the bars
should be placed apart?” In your experience with looking at trial bars and the
aerodynamics of them, what do you recommend? – Well there is a best arm position for every individual person, actually, that’s the whole point. For instance, when you see Michael Weiss or Sebastian Kienle on
the triathlon bikes, they have a really flat out position. Those guys are tested in wind tunnels and have direct tests every year, so they know spot on what’s best for them. – It’s interesting
because in recent years, that high hands position,
the praying mantis, has become really popular,
and also a lot of people look at that as being
faster, and they look at the older Cancellara,
Tony Martin position, and like you say, Jan Frodeno, clearly very good for him. – For instance, yeah. – Triathlete. But then they think oh, well he doesn’t know the high hands thing, but
it’s like what you’re saying, for some people that’s faster. – It’s not working out for him. It’s a really personal
thing, so you can’t say 90% of the people is riding in
this praying mantis position, so it also should be the best for me. No, not at all. – It’s best for me
though, we’ve tested it. I found out. (laughing) So a great question from Mark Brimacombe, who says “Who is the most
aero pro you’ve worked with?” – Well for instance Victor Campenaerts, of course, he’s way up there. He’s trying to save every
single watt that’s possible. – So I’ve got a question, and that is just how do you make them? What’s the process you go through in order to make these for an athlete? – To make the handlebar, we have to make a mold of your lower arm. So while you’re on the
bike, in your aero position, we will make a mold, where
we use these plate for. This is like a thermal plastic material. So we heat it up in a box of water or whatsoever, and when it’s all hot, it becomes very flexible. When you’re in the position, we apply this material to your
arm, and actually wrap it with a bandage so we get every imprint, every vein we can see within the imprint. Something like this, and of course we want to smooth it out a
little, and there’s always this wrinkles, for
instance you will always have an imprint of your
normal arm pad over here, which you don’t want to
have in the Speedbar. So that’s what we have to sand out and make it like one smooth curved line. And that’s actually why we applied a few first layers of carbon fiber on. So this is the really first start to making the handlebars. Which we then cut out in
the shape that we want. We glue a tube underneath, so it can house the internal cable routing, then we give it it’s final shape, and we wrap it again with a few layers of carbon fiber to make it
really steady and sturdy. Then comes the most tricky part, which is actually positioning
it on your base bar. So over here we have, this
is a specialized base bar. In the end, we have to position it somewhere in the correct angle, and the correct width,
and the correct position that you would like to
have it on your bike. To do that, we integrate the spacers that come with the
handlebar into the Speedbar. – So is that what you’ve got here? – That’s what we’ve got over here. So this is like a spacer that’s integrated into the Speedbar. Then we apply again a few layers of carbon fiber, and then actually the Speedbar’s technically ready. After that it goes to the paint shop and gives it a nice smooth coat, and then you’ve got
your finished Speedbar. – Nice, right, well thank you so much for coming out, and it’s amazing to see the products, and it’s great to speak to someone who’s doing such a little artisan cottage industry that’s permeated pro-cycling
in such an incredible way. But yeah, thanks very much man. – Thank you. – And yeah, if you’ve got any questions for Edwin, let us know
in the comment section down below, and I guess you can log in on YouTube and answer them– – Of course, yeah.
– And we’ll try and answer them as well. (metal grinding) Few issues are as divisive as mudguards, slash fenders, if you’re
American, to us road cyclists. But now Null Winds’ technology recon that their aero defender mudguard, or fender, is going to also make you faster, in addition to protecting you, your bike and your friends from road spray. Check this out. Apparently this intriguing
aero shaped product will outperform any aero
wheel on the market, according to Null Winds’ claims, and they’ve got a patent
on it and everything. I mean the only downside really is if you’re a pro, you can’t stick it on your bike in a race, because under the UCI rules,
those pesky UCI rules, it counts as a fairing,
which means it’s not allowed. But if you like me, you’re not a pro, well fill your boots. But I want to know what do you think? Hot or not? The news Aerodefender mudguard. You can vote somewhere on screen. Having been spotted at
the tour down under, Felt has official announced
its new aero bike, the advanced AR. Now the new bike has all the hallmarks of a modern, disc equipped aero road bike. So you’ve got aero tube profiles, kind of like slightly dropped seat stays, and lots of integration,
and this integrated stem, which all the cables run through, which Cycling Tips rather amusingly described as Jabba’s sail
barge, which tickled me. It does look like Jabba’s sail barge. But check this out, and it’s available in three different options. So you can get a frame set only option, Ultegra DI2, and
mechanical Ultegra as well. Certainly very nice looking bike. More hot tech next week. (drill whirring) Cha-ching! It’s now time for screw
riding upgrades, buy upgrades, where you submit evidence of the changes that you’ve made to the equipment and cycling infrastructure
within your life. This can take the form of cave paintings. We’ve never had a cave painting. Sculptures, animations, but
usually it’s just photos. Anyhow, last week was a battle between Jeffree’s Merckx,
and Bruce Andrew’s Carrera. And the winner was Bruce
Andrew’s Carrera with 76%, quite a comprehensive victory, that. The cap is in the post. So as I didn’t mention this in the intro, this is the chance for you to win the ultimate prize, a GCN cap, or casquette, if you’re French. So this week’s contenders are, first up, Friedrich who’s from Hanau, Deutschland. He has a Bianchi Rekord, 920. 1986, this bike. He says he found this
unused Bianchi Rekord as just a frame set, and he also found some Campy cranks as well, lying around in an old garage, and decided to go for what he described
as a neo-retro build, because he needed a winter
bike in Deutschland. So first he looked for a few fork, because the original one
had been broken in a crash. So he went for a Columbus chrome fork to match the chrome chain stays. He then got a few other bits, like a pair of Cinelli handlebars, and some other bits that he found in an old parts bin. Nice to recycle those. He then looked for a
saddle and handlebar tape, and he says there was
only one color option he’d ever consider for this bike, chilest. I mean (sighs) John would have loved that. Anyhow, he then needed a group set, so he went for the
group set of the people, Shimano 105, 5890, 11 speed, right, which amazingly he said he found on Ebay for just 100 bucks. Strange though, because I thought the currency was euros in Germany. Anyhow, he’s also put on a pair of Ultegra breaks, which he said he got for a very low
price, and then he’s put on a pair of Zipp 30
wheels, 11 speed cassette, and some Conti X lightweight tires. He says they ride like a dream. What shall we think of this? Let’s have a look. Wow, I mean look at that. Look at where it was. Look at it now. Those wheels, the Zipp 30 wheels, for what they cost,
they look really smart. That is awesome. That’s amazing what you’ve done with that, considering what it started with, and that fork as well, the fact that it’s got a stainless
steel finish on it, that looks really smart. I tell you what, whoever’s
up against Friedrich is going to struggle, I think, this week, so let’s see who it is. This week, up against Friedrich, we’ve got Robin Burger, who’s done that classic thing we often
see in the upgrades segment, which is to turn an old mountain bike into a all-terrain
gravel bike, if you will, but I prefer the term mixed surface. So check this out, he’s got his frame, which is a nice Marin frame,
classic 90s mountain bike. I used to have an old Marin. And then he’s changed his saddle, you can see there, and he’s turned it into a drop bar conversion,
which looks great, and he’s changed the group set, so he’s put two by 10 speed
Ultegra 6600 on there, which is a cracking group set. I used to have that group
set on one of my bikes. And he’s also changed
the bottom bracket out for one of the Hollowtech ones. Also upgraded his tires to some nice Schwalbe ones there, and also a new look on the fork as well. Also put on some bottle cages, changed his pedals and stuff as well. But I mean because he
started with what was a nice frame that’s lasted
and is in really good nick, there’s sort of no need to really change the way it looks, but I
do like what he’s done with the fork, that looks cool. Well I mean it’s not up to me, is it? You decide, you know the drill. There’s a link somewhere on screen. John always knew where the
links were on the screen. Well, there’ll be a link,
just click on the link. (metal grinding) It’s now time for the bit
you’ve all been waiting for, the Bike Vault, where you submit pictures of your bikes,
and then we judge them to be either nice or super nice. If they’re super nice, then we ring this. This is the bell. And they go into the Bike Vault. But fear not, if you
disagree with our judgements, which let’s face it, you often do, then don’t worry, you
can have your own say at home by voting in the GCN app. And we’ll post next
week’s Bike Vault entries in the app ahead of the show,
so you can vote before we do. Right, without further ado, let’s crack on and see what we’ve got this week. So first up, we’ve got Santanahakuba, who has this rather nice
BMC Road Machine there. Is that a Road Machine? Oh it’s a Team Machine TR01. Wow, look at that. It’s got some rather nice Ultegra DI2, but also that looks like an XTR DI2 rear derailleur on there. So he’s got a massive cassette on there, but it looks like he lives
in a very mountainous place, so that’s pretty cool to
have hacked that together. I remember seeing Team
Sky using some XTI stuff on the back of their bikes. I think Wiggins actually
did it, back in the day, on some very steep roads,
so that’s pretty cool. I like that, because it is all cross compatible as well, which is nice. I like your orange bar tape. I like the Mavic sticker
you’ve got on there. But I mean you’re not in biggie smalls, and the cranks aren’t aligned
at the three o’clock position. You’ve got Mavic sticker on the fork, and on the top tubes, I kind of like that Mavic thing going on, that’s pretty cool. You’ve got your Mavic wheels on there. And apparently this is
in the Japanese Alps, which does look amazing,
although that sign is a little worrying with the
boulders falling on you there. You probably shouldn’t have stopped in that particular location. It’s such a nice place. I’m torn. Okay, nice. (bell ringing) Right next, I mean super nice. (whacking) I can’t even do it right. It’s like, I just wish
John was here. (laughing) Anyway, next up we have got, oh wow! Look at that, it’s Giant Propel. Oh man, this is someone who has watched the “How to get in the Bike Vault” video. Check this out, this is AshBurke14. “Took this photo just before competing “in the Australian National Gran Fondo.” Wow, look at that. I mean tires, wheels
aligned, valves aligned. Running tubeless, like it. No spacers above the stem. He’s removed the accessories. Nice clear background. I mean you’re making my life easy. I like that. Super nice. (whacking)
(bell ringing) Right, next up we’ve got, wow, that’s another nice one, Cinelli. Being a Cinelli, classic
single speed bikes, and there’s something I just
love about a single speed. They’re just so cool
and elegant and clean. I’ll tell you what actually, bonus marks, because getting your wheels aligned with your valves aligned on a single speed is no mean feat, because
the back wheel is fixed. So the fact that you’ve gone to the extra, extra effort of doing that,
I think deserves bonus marks. I mean your pedal’s not quite aligned, but I’m going to let that slide, because it’s hard on a single speed. And I love that fade on
the bar tape as well, and it matches the blue on the frame. I think that’s gorgeous. That’s super nice. Another one. (whacking)
(bell ringing) I’m in quite a good mood this week. Right. Next up we’ve got this from MJohnson. He’s submitted his Trek, oh my goodness. That appears to be an American
alligator in the background. There are two types of alligator, obviously they vary in size. There’s the American alligator
and the Chinese alligator, this being of course the more prevalent American alligator,
being in North America. They grow up to 11.2
feet, three and a half meters long, and typically weigh up to 454 kilograms, half a ton. Interesting fact for you, the temperature of the alligator’s nest determines what sex the offspring will be. So females are produced
when the temperatures are below 82.4 degrees Fahrenheit, and males are produced at temperatures above 91.4 degrees Fahrenheit. So a temperature of 87. Johnson, you’re precariously
close to that alligator there, although if you are Michael Johnson, who won gold in the 200
meters in Atlanta 96, then I guess you don’t
need to worry about that. Anyway, super nice alligator. (whacking)
(bell ringing) And finally in the Bike Vault this week, we’ve got this stunner from Lucas Tavora, who’s submitted his beautiful
Cannondale SuperSix. I’ve got a soft spot for these bikes, I have to admit, I love the flat top tube, and it’s something that’s becoming a bit of a rarity in modern bike design. We’re not seeing as many
flat top tubes these days, but it’s the classic
proportion to the road bike. I love the tan side wall,
Vittoria Corsa tires. You’ve got Supacaz bar tape on there, that’s really cool. Nice carbon Selle Italia SLR Flow saddle. And some nice little details as well. No excess steerer above the stem. I like your little add on, custom, light weight, quick release
skewers you’ve put on there. And you’re ticking the boxes as well. No actually, not quite biggie smalls, but biggie smallish, so
we’ll let that slide. You’ve not lined up your valves either, and how have you actually
propped that bike up? I’m struggling to see the
stick that you’ve used. You’ve hidden it well,
you’ve hidden it well. I don’t know how you’ve
propped that up, magic. Also your saddle to bar drop is massive. That’s a huge step off you’ve got there. It almost looks like you’ve done that sneaky thing of raising your saddle just for the picture
to try and impress us, even though I have no idea
why that would impress anyone. Anyway. It’s a really nice bike, I really like it, but you’re just ignoring the rules, and there’s not like there’s a dangerous apex predator in the background that’s prevented you
from tweaking the bike and getting it in tip top Bike
Vault submission condition. Nice, it’s a nice from me. Yeah, must try harder Lucas. Anyhow, that’s all we’ve got time for for the Bike Vault this week, so make sure you submit your Bike Vault entries using the GCN app, and you
can vote on next weeks too. Unfortunately, that’s all
we’ve got time for this week. It’s nearly the end of the show. Thanks for watching. I hope you’ve enjoyed it. And also massive thanks to Edwin for coming in and giving up his time. Fascinating to hear about the Speedbar, and if you’ve got any questions about that just fire them in the comments, and we’ll try and get
back to you on those. And if you’d like to get your hands on one of these splendid GCN tops, or any other GCN merch, well you can do. You’re in luck, it’s all available in shop.globalcyclingnetwork. I’m going to go now. Bye. (upbeat music)

Only registered users can comment.

  1. Yea buddy! #askgcntech I always wanted to know why no one uses dragon skin carbon fiber fabric? There are so many different patterns!

  2. Ollie mate. You never PM’d me about my offer of anywhere up to and and including £11.70 for the 3D model of your bust Sir. Yours in anticipation C.F O’Sullivan. P.S good luck Sir with your hour record attempt 🥰😍😘

  3. awesome custom bars, but i can't help thinking at 3600 euros it's a big eff you to the EU, or the UK…. one way or another. ha ha. post Brexit pricing for all ! . 120 euros an hour for your time is spectacular. that's lawyer rate, mate !

    good for you ! i wish i could afford them, and i also wish i deserved them but i'm no athlete, ha ha ! i am sure they are amazing. here, i can hire an acclaimed tailor to make me 2 bespoke suits for that price. then again, i ain't no model either so…

  4. I enjoyed this episode of the GCN Aero Tech Show, Edwin was a great guest and Ollie was true to his school. And those fenders are hot, why not if they make your bike faster with the lines of a hot rod Lincoln. And glad that Ollie von Bavaria came out of the forest to make an appearance 🙂

  5. It's amazing how much money people will pay for these custom aero bars, you can make them yourself at home for less than £80

  6. I'm sorry but I have to repeat my statements from last week. Don't mess with a working formula. Losing Jon, bad move. Leaving Ollie by himself, worse move. I'll give it a week or two the let the dust settle. However, if it's going to be two fifths bad interview and the rest the tech show presented by a non-tech, I'm done. 

    Ollie, I do not mean this personally, this just isn't your niche. You're a good reporter but you're not a mechanic. This show needs a mechanic and someone that geeks out on bikes and bike tech. The person should be so into the bike that that alligator could bite them in the ass and they don't even notice.

    I have been working on an upgrade for almost 6 months with the intention of posting it to see if it gets picked up for the show and the competition. I am literally finishing it in the next 24 hours, but now I don't even want to post it.

  7. 3600 for 30 man-hour (it looks like it's really man, this man, and no woman or in between) works out at 120 per hour. Bar the materials, of which there's not so less… I'm going with him: that's a honest price.

  8. Ollie with those bars and all the other super expensive kit there is no excuse for failure and we are all counting on you during the hour record attempt! Let's add a forfeit. If you fail you should shave your head or something… Thumbs up for support please

  9. This would have to be one of the saddest tech show. Despite the very Duran Duran hair style ollie, which is awesome, no-banter on this show just made it very somber. C'mon GCN director, get it together…..get two guys in there.!!

  10. The Cannondale bike was free standing,the person on the right was just waiting to catch it before it fell over. Check out the shadow….

  11. I'm kind of confused because Edwin explained that he's working completely on his own. But then he always refers to "us". Like "we attach the thermoplastic mould" and "we integrate the handlebar mount".

  12. Ollie you're such a good actor, honestly I feel like you've been on the show forever. Tell Jon we said hi if you can.

  13. You can see in the last picture the shadow of a person standing behind the camera… it's probably a friend or so who held the bike and just let go for a second to take the photo! No dark magic was used for that photo:)

  14. Riders aren't being honest with themselves or the sport about whats "commercially available". Its a total Hoax! They price these parts crazy high, and give crazy wait times of 1 or 2 years to prevent them from ever actually being ordered!

  15. 23:37 See that shadow of a person on the right? He's the one holding the bike and just letting go at the moment the shot is taken. That's how it's done, Ollie. 😊

  16. Ollie, The last cannondale is mine! I admit I should’ve put more effort, but I had little time till the next car be passing by… and there was no stick, you can see the shadow of me friend, who was holding the bike half of a second before… Glad you liked me bike!! Cheers…

  17. get jon back please. not the same when you know its not just 1-2 without him because hes on a trip. show isnt same with no jon.

  18. It isn’t the same without Jon, usually Jon and Ollie both have good claims and add on one another. Now it’s just a one side opinion 😔😔

  19. How long does it take for the polls to appear in the app? Show is out, but can't find the upgrades poll there…

  20. The aero defender mud guards don’t look like they would be very good at keeping the spray from the front wheel off the rider,

  21. Cool thing about Speedbar, is nice seeing that still one man can make a bussiness without the big companies crushing him.

    funny how Everytime he says "we" he just means "I" and later says its a "one man show"

  22. The most Aero position isn’t always the right Position. It always depends on the rider and the course. For me, I have this point of being low at the front, were power just dwindles to nothing. Also, when my arms get to close in the elbows, I am more aero, yet really shaky in my handling of the bike. This gives me less confidence and makes it more daring to go as fast as possible.

  23. Its so hard to watch Ollie with his insulting accents, patronizing tone, and shallow tech knowledge … ugh… I really hope the tech show gets someone competent and excited about tech to replace Jon!

  24. Beside the 3600€ you also have to fly/accommodation to their HQ in order to make a mold, 10k euro for some bar extensions? Ok, maybe this one is best left with the pros

  25. What about the arm rest pads – don't they affect the aerodynamics? Or is it too slight change in rider position in comparison to measurements they made to even take it in account?

  26. There was definitely something missing from this show. Jon WAS the GCN Tech Show. While Ollie is great and very entertaining, it's just not the same without Jon. The banter between the two was terrific. Sorry to see Jon move on but the show still needs another character, just as the GCN Show needs two presenters. Can you imagine Dan or Simon alone with no one else to needle or to offer opposing views?

  27. Jon, I'm sorry for making fun of your shoes and hat. Please come back to the tech show. I also apologize for spelling your name wrong in my last comment. #dadshoes

  28. #askgcntech Hey guys – my question is why are most road bikes equipped with hydraulic rather than mechanical disc brakes? It seems that hydraulic makes more sense on a mountain bike, but not on a road bike. Like the usual negatives with discs are usually weight, and maintenance, and e.g. race teams needing to bleed their brake lines after flying. It seems like mechanical disc brakes would have been better all round, plus I very much doubt the braking performance between hydraulic vs mechanical discs would be that great or warranted unless as I say you were on a mountain bike. Plus with mechanical there wouldn't be that big of a difference in weight to rim brakes due to no master cylinders, fluids, etc. Thanks!

  29. After the shameful support to the apartheid Zionist state from you GCN I decide to unfollow and I call all the people that have a decent level of morality to do so.

  30. Please bring back the voting in the video!
    The app is nice and all but im not gonna bother getting my phone for small stuff like this. Makes me interact less

  31. Everyone has a pair: Si and Dan, Chris and Hank, Connor and Manon, but Ollie is on his own now and it just doesn't feel right.

  32. sorry guys this just does not cut it , ultegra is not anything but ultegra an does not make a bike better , ollie has moved from cycling weakly to gcn tech how ?

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